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a treasurer's question - 6/27/2010 7:35:35 PM
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SurrenderALL
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Now I have to take the treasurer's role in our small church (as seen in the post 'when only 9 people left'. There was no financial policy in the past years and now I am drafting a document. Because my co-signer has cosigned with the previous treasurer. She told me that our weekly offering sometimes had been held in the treasurer's hand for one month before it was deposited. But I think money need to be counted as soon as possible (no later than leaving Chruch on Sunday) and be deposited as soon as possible (no later than one bank business day).
But the question comes: How we deal with the offering when either one of our team (currently only me and my cosigner) is not available on Sunday. The previous chose to hold and wait until both are available. But I don't think it is wise to hold the money too long. Can any one give me some advices?
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/27/2010 9:51:14 PM
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peace77
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If one member of the counting team is absent, then someone else should be chosen even if just to fill in one time.
You are correct that it is not wise to hold onto funds. There is always a risk that they could be stolen or lost in a fire or other disaster.
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/27/2010 10:04:21 PM
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ta_mosquito
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My husband and I are our church treasurers.
We bring the money home on Sunday, lock it up, then count it on Monday after Hubby gets home from work. Lock it up, then I deposit it on Tuesday. Hubby and his family have this thing about "working" on Sundays, and counting the offering is apparently part of the prohibition. 
I don't know how we'd work it if we had someone else (non-family) counting it as well. But I do agree to count and deposit it ASAP.
What type of gifts does your congregation give - cash or checks? If it's checks, you could photocopy them so the other cosigner can "see" them. If it's cash, you can't really do that. (Our congregation gives in cash, for the most part, so it's imperative to double check the counting and designation of who gave what that particular Sunday.)
A lot of it comes down to a matter of trust. Having strict policies in place is great. Our church doesn't have that, unfortunately, but it DOES trust us as treasurers to count and credit it correctly.
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/27/2010 10:14:24 PM
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AlwaysR8chel
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...... The church I came from has a team of tellers who count the $$. That way there is always at least two people present. (They assign Sundays and communicate if someone can't attend.)
They count the offerings after church on Sunday and fill out a report sheet together.
The $$ is then given to the head teller for depositing. It's ideally deposited on Mondays.
The opened envelopes and the report are brought in and given to our Treasurer usually by Tuesday.
Since the Treasurer is a check signer... he doesn't touch the deposit or any offerings. (Standard office procedures.)
Standard office procedures are to deposit income ASAP and to pay bills as close to the due date (without going over) as possible.
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/27/2010 11:12:38 PM
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bolt.
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In our Church, we count (and do the record keeping) immediately after the service, in the Church office -- with two finance committee members when possible. If that is impossible, one finance person counts, and another trusted member of the congregation acts as an 'observer' (such as a deacon or elder). We seal the deposit (two people present) and one person deposits it in a secure drop slot at a bank near the Church on the way home.
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/28/2010 10:51:33 AM
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DaveW
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If you only have 8 or 9 people, that certainly makes things difficult. I would see if there is at least one other adult that is trustworthy enough to occasionally help out.
It is always good to get the $$ into the bank account ASAP. Holding onto funds for a month is not wise. You may want to find out if there are transaction fees on the account(s) and if they are hefty, start looking for another bank that is not so bad. That may have been the reason the former treasurer only made one deposit a month.
We have a Financial Services Committee (FSC) which is headed by a treasurer who is accountable both to the elder board but also to the deacons. Our current treasurer is not a deacon but the previous 2 were. Two FSC members count the offerings after the meetings and fill out the deposit paperwork. The congregation's secretary then deposits the funds on Monday AM. She then returns the paperwork to the treasurer for verification of deposit and amounts.
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/28/2010 12:25:43 PM
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SurrenderALL
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Thank you all for valuable advices. Yes, trust is essencial whichout trust we cannot do it at all. And I feel the high responsibility to be trusted by our congragation.
Yesterday I mentioned that we should have another member to fill in counting when one of our team is absent. But our cosigner said that we should avoid having more people seeing the individual offering amounts because the congragation dosen't like that. Maybe this is why our previous team chose to hold the offering. Holding definitely scares me, but I don't want to disrespect the congragation in order to make myself more comfortable.
Any suggestions?
< Message edited by SurrenderALL -- 6/28/2010 12:34:01 PM >
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/28/2010 12:29:25 PM
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SurrenderALL
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quote:
ORIGINAL: AlwaysR8chel
Since the Treasurer is a check signer... he doesn't touch the deposit or any offerings. (Standard office procedures.)
Standard office procedures are to deposit income ASAP and to pay bills as close to the due date (without going over) as possible.
I didn't know this before. Currently we may not to able to follow this now since we are short of workers. But this sounds important to know. We should alway consider to change our policy and rules when church congragation becomes bigger. Could you explain why the check signer should not touch the offering and deposit?
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/29/2010 9:31:32 AM
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AlwaysR8chel
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..... it helps minimize the opportunity for theft or fraud. Having the duties split up between different people assures accountability.
If you ever get audited, this is one of the areas that would be addressed.
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The bottom line for all of this is that the money really belongs to God. Our Tellers do not talk about what offering comes in, or who gave what. The secretary who posts the offerings to the computer doesn't talk about what comes in, or who gave what... it's better to have the mindset that giving is between the patron and God - and to not entertain any other thoughts.
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צוּר On God my salvation and my glory rest; The rock of my strength, my refuge is in God.
Psalms 62:7 NASB
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/29/2010 3:50:22 PM
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FunBetty
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At my previous church, the sunday offering was locked in a safe, where it was counted by two people on Monday (occasionally Tuesday). It was always the same two people - one was a staff member and another was selected by the congregation. The money was always deposited right away after being counted.
Having more than one person is important for accountability.
Also, one thing to keep in mind...when you hold on to an offering for say a month, you run a risk of not only something happening to that money, but also if checks are written people expect them to clear in a certain length of time.
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/29/2010 7:49:35 PM
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iamnotforgotten
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I am one of 12 counters at our church. We work in teams of two and rotate during the year. I only count twice a year. We count immediately following service, and then one of the counters will bring the money to the bank that day and drop it in the night deposit.
quote:
The bottom line for all of this is that the money really belongs to God. Our Tellers do not talk about what offering comes in, or who gave what. The secretary who posts the offerings to the computer doesn't talk about what comes in, or who gave what... it's better to have the mindset that giving is between the patron and God - and to not entertain any other thoughts.
So TRUE! Our church is having a lot of financial problems and one of the board members asked the treasurer how much our regular attenders gave - she told him that it was none of his business. go her.
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/29/2010 8:42:48 PM
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ta_mosquito
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quote:
So TRUE! Our church is having a lot of financial problems and one of the board members asked the treasurer how much our regular attenders gave - she told him that it was none of his business. go her.
I agree with having that info be confidential.
However, do you think it's OK to give information in aggregate? For example, saying that out of those who have offering envelopes, X% give Y% of the offerings... the average offering is $Z per week, etc.? Or do you think that all such information should be confidential, individual info AND aggregate?
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/29/2010 11:31:26 PM
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SurrenderALL
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I think indivudual offering should be confidential. But the aggregate can be reported. We give financial report every month. Any memeber has the right to ask about the income and expenses. We used to report every week. Now I am deciding to report every month.
I am just in between (1) opening to one more person when one of our team is absent and (2) holding it for one or more weeks until both of us are available. I am kind of prefer the (1).
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RE: a treasurer's question - 6/30/2010 7:22:11 AM
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buckifn
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It's a good idea to remember choosing a third person to fill in as needed protects you as well as protects the money. If you were to put yourself in a position of handling the cash alone you open yourself up to being falsely accused of mishandling funds.
Also taking the money to the bank asap is important. We do all of our deposits no later than the next business day.
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RE: a treasurer's question - 7/28/2010 3:01:22 PM
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Core724
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Money is a very tough issue in a church setting. First, the money should NEVER be left alone with a single individual. Second, it should NEVER EVER, be taken to a person's home. While it may be an honest family doing this, the impression may be not so favorable. And it is very difficult to prove you did not steal when you are the only one around the money. You always have an extra person available to count the money and then take it to the bank the same day (Sunday) and then deposit it in the night drop box. If the bank does not have a night drop box, get a safe in the church and lock it up until morning and then take it in.
You have to remember: Whether or not you are honest and holy has very little to do with the situation. It comes down to the impression that others have. If the impression is you have the opportunity to take money, that is a persons reality.
With money and kids, it is better to be overly cautious!
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